Defensive Driving Course For 4x4's

[Shadow_D]

4WD SUV's are getting to be very popular these days and people are wrecking them more than they need to be. Why is this? I think it is do to "Driver Inexperience". Most new SUV owners think they can do anything with there 4X4. The truth is they can with the proper training however, the only training course I have ever seen was put together by Jeep for there new owners and I have not heard anything about it in a few years so I don't know if it is still around.

I wish the Federal Highway Administration and Department of Transportation would get together with the Department of Motorvehicles in all states and offer some kind of SUV training course to anyone that owns an SUV much like a defensive driving course. This course should teach people the dangers of an SUV, what they can and can't do & offer a hands on driving course so they don't make the same mistakes many others have made.
The current defensive driving course will give people a 10% reduction in their insurance rates and remove some points from there license.
I don't think the points reduction is good for this course but the 10% insurance reduction would be a great idea.

I know Jeep owners pay higher insurance rates for their CJs and Wranglers because they are "off-road vehicles"
This is just an idea I have that spawned from another post that I didn't want to go too far off topic.
So what do you all think?

 

[Broncoholics]

I always liked the "I can do anything" mentality when i'm out wheelin! Its actually taught me quite a bit about what the rig is capable of quickly.

 

[Desert Donk]

It is a good idea. In fact there is an article in the paper this week that 7 but not sure that we could talk the insurance industry in giving a discount for it. But they might subsidize the idea. I see insurance companies getting into many things here in AZ. Most notably a program here in AZ to help curb auto thefts. We have the highest auto theft rate in the nation right now. See the web site I will list here. Most of this was paid for by the insurance companies. And they have big signup sessions at the malls. They have policemen there, and firemen to check out infant car seat installations all at the same time. They give out free 'Clubs' for steering wheels / columns that are paid for by the insurance companies. here is the link: http://www.azwatchyourcar.com/

What would you think about a booklet explaining the unique driving requirements of SUV's. It might be more cost effective as on the whole I have no idea how much money SUV's cost the insurance companies because folks don't know how to drive them. Here is another article from today's newspaper here, but they don't mention how many were SUV's.






Local News

Nearly Half of Fatal Accidents On State Highways Involved Rollovers
09-15-2004 3:05 AM

(Phoenix, AZ) -- Department of Public Safety officials say nearly half of all the fatal accidents on Arizona highways last month involved a vehicle leaving the road and rolling over. DPS reports a small percent of the rollovers involved tire problems. The majority, though, were linked to drivers not paying attention or being too tired. Of the 64 people who were killed in crashes last month, 32 died in rollovers and weren't wearing seat belts.

 

[Shadow_D]

The AATA looks like a good system, we had something like that here in NY some years back but it kind of died out.
The news article also has some good info but you are right there is no mention as to how many were SUVs or even Tractor Trailers. Those numbers also include the big wreck in Tonopah. That one stands out in my mind because I used to drive Tractor Trailer and remember running out of hours there for 3 days. Great food at that truckstop.

 

[Ktomek06]

I think you have a point..send your idea to ford!! I would, you might get somethign in return.

 

[BigNasty]

for insurance purposes, I like the idea of a safety course.
BUT in the real world.. until there is a heavy fine and other penalties for being stoopit... such as cell phones on the ears.. TVs, playstations, reading the paper or books etc while driving, remote controls for the CD player (which is in arms reach anyways.. )
then we will always have the high numbers of accidents we have now.
The biggest factor I see is peoples driving habits in general.. it doesn't matter what they drive as I have seen man sporty cars flipped and rolled for the same errors in judgement that causes an SUV roll-over.
Until peoples mentalities behind the wheel changes and all the un-needed distractions go away.. the only good that will come is cheaper insurance rates.
Same difference as cheaper rates for equipping your vehicle with an alarm..
Alarms don't stop break-ins etc and usually wake you up for no reason.

I know.. I'm just a ray of happiness tonight

 

[walterm]

There are remote controls, it is a fineable offense to have any type Television forward of driver, cellphone calls are not allowed here($500-fine), and about the stupid driving, it's called either careless opperation, or wreckless endangerment. And as far as the class goes, it's a great idea. I see classes all over for performance driving (sports cars), defensive driving (prior ticket getters) and response training (Fire/E.M.S.). Most of theese supply cars (Escort or Civic), or they don't do anything but watch films. The biggest problem a school has is money. The only this kind of way this will work is if people bring thier own S.U.V.'s, which poses another problem. NO TWO S.U.V.s HANDLE THE SAME. Example, a Tahoe is alot less likely to roll than a Bronco II or an Explorer. My wife-to-be is a Lawyer (wannabe God), she drives a Tahoe. I own a Jeep and 2 B2's. I can do things in her truck that neither of mine could never attempt, and vise-versa. The idea of a class is great, but there are so many things not common between the S.U.V.'s, that there is too few people with enough knowledge about all the S.U.V's on the market. Jeep still has a course, but none of the other auto manufactures care enough or are too money hungry to do something like that. I have friends at one of the major insurance companies (State Farm), my better half being an attorney, and I can easily get the funding to something like this. Being in public service, I am known by everyone in my community. so getting sponsered isn't going to be too hard. anyone with some idea's or wanting to help do something with this, please contact me at either [email protected] or [email protected]. or can call me @ 225-766-0571 my name is Lt. walter moreau. It's not too often people have good ideas like such, but this is one I truely support. Nice going, at least someone cares enough to share an idea to help the public instead of thier selves. Thank you.

 

[Windchaser]

I like the idea of 4x4 driving courses...Too many people get into a SUV and think they can blow around a 30mph curve at 60 or faster and roll it. Blazers were horrible for this while (*cue superman theme song*) the Bronco's did much better. /

 

[Shadow_D]

walterm:
You are right to a point with too few people with enough knowledge however, if we can get all of the auto manufacturers that offer some kind of SUV together it might work for people using their own vehicle. The Ford people should know all of there vehicles, Chevy should know there's and so on.
The hardest part would be to get the auto makers on board with the insurance companies.
The tests have been done by Car & Driver Magazine, J. D. Power and a few others. We shouldn't have much trouble getting the reports from them as I believe they have been made public.
I am trying to contact my insurance agent to find out where to start with this.
I am also going to try to contact Ford and see what they think and give them the address of this post.

More to come, I hope.......

 

[walterm]

i've done some research on this and found out alot. 1.This is very possable. 2.on a local level, there quite a few people interested in this type of class. weather it's for thier new teenage (I can drive anything) driver, or thier wives that have only driven tiny, front wheel drive, 4 cyl, cars. that now want ford excursions and yukons. my only point is, if started now, classes could be possable by november. I've talked to the D.M.V. here and they are mailing me the forms needed to start this. also I've spoke to state farm and they want a writen perposal on the whole thing. so right now I'm in need of some help. I've already left my contact information, if anyone has any free time, and wants to help with the research, please call or e-mail me. thanks, walter

 

[Shadow_D]

walterm:
Check your email. I have also been working on getting people involved on my end. I am working with Ford's Test Track Division and the people form "Camp Jeep" as well as the NYS Insurance Department.
This looks like it could go all the way /

 

[walterm]

You know, it feels really good to know there are still people that care about others. People theese days are too self centered and inconsiderate.

 

[Justshootme84]

Sounds like a GREAT idea to me guys! Whenever I go to buy a 4wheeler/ATV, there are local trainings on how to ride and drive them. The SUV or even a 4WD program would be very helpful even for folks that have driven something similar before. A Hummer H2 or Dodge Durango handle way differently from each other as well as from the average sedan. I also see people driving way too fast on the roads.

 

[walterm]

is there anyone intrested in possably teaching one of the classes? I found out everything I need from the legal standpoint. it's not that hard to do, or cost too much to start. so the likely hood of doing this is very high. shadow D, e-mail me a number to contact you. I've got a few questions for you.

 

[hawk2100n]

people need to know also that suv's take a lot longer to stop than cars. i see accidents all of the time involvong a SUV that rear-ended a car that could stop quicker. most of the time it is at stoplights when people have to panic break to stop for the light and the person behind plows into them and i think that the insurance companies would really like the idea that a trained driver is less likely to tailgate and therefore less likely to rear-end someone. Also, i think it wouldnt take long for an instructor to learn the general charactaristics of various suv's, because similar sized and model year vehicles behave similarly.

 

[walterm]

There are no two S.U.V.s that handle the same. Although you may have two of the same make, model, and year. suspension wear, different tires, and road conditions, make them handle nothing alike. as far as stoping, the average fullsive S.U.V. takes aprox.60 to 120 feet more than a typical compact car. no counting wet or icy roads. the sooner the public sees this, the better.

 

[brian_n_texas]

Something that would be good to do would be to somehow demonstrate the different characteristics of a typical passenger car and a typical SUV and show how the difference in their ability in making some driving maneuvers has led to the increase in rollovers - I'm talking about statistics generated by the general public, which includes the overwhelming majority of 4-wheel drive vehicle owners who have not and will probably never go off-road.
It's basic physics; a vehicle with a lower center of gravity has less of a tendency to roll over. This is something that the car buying (SUV buying) public needs to be educated in, and it will take efforts like the one going on here to point this out.

You will never hear anything about rollover potential from a car dealer or on a TV commercial!

 

[Bradt]

There are no two S.U.V.s that handle the same. Although you may have two of the same make, model, and year. suspension wear, different tires, and road conditions, make them handle nothing alike.

Absolutely no two handle the same, but there are common characteristics. Two of the most important I think is the increased stopping distance, and the higher center of gravity. Then there's the basic issue of size.

I just wish someone would offer a class for these idiots to learn to park. If I can put my 88 bronco in the middle of a space without it being crooked, why can't half the other drivers at least get almost in the space with their little "SUVs"?

I'm no pro offroader, but I think this is a great idea. If there's anything I can do here in GA to help please let me know.

 

[walterm]

bradt, any help you can give would be greatly appriciated. you can contact me at 225-766-0571 or e-mail [email protected] I am in the process of getting the classes started and I'm almost there.

 

[billybroncojr]

You know why the Germans don't design cup holders into their interiors? Because they take their driving seriously! When you are driving 150+ mph you shouldn't be messing with a drink let alone everything that us stupid Americans mess with while driving. We could learn a thing or two from them, after all they do own Jeep now. The same vehicle that helped defeat them in WWII.
I own a mini-van, I hate to admit it but I do, and I refuse to put anything beyond a cd player in it. There is no place on the road for a TV! We are going to raise a generation of kids that never know how to get anywhere because the spent their childhood in the backseat watching their favorite DVD of Barney a million times and can't find the corner store now because they never watched where mom and dad was driving them!
I fill my kids head every time a traffic sitiation occurs. I ask them where we are and how to get home from there. I also let them sit on my lap and steer the vehicle. I live on a private road so there is no traffic, but it give them the experiance of driving. They won't be the 16 year olds that have never been behind the wheel. By the time they are 16 they should be a step ahead I hope.
Education and experiance is the key.

My-2-Cents,
Jeff